REPLY: Whew, this is a toughy. Because, I believe your instincts are right there in that I, too, believe this horse was never properly socialized to other horses and was kept isolated (like sadly too many stallions are these days, to their own detriment). Problem is, nature provided a "window" for proper horse socialization, ideally within a herd, that first year or so of life, then that window tends to close, I've found. I honestly don't know how you are going to get him socialized to other horses properly now, but safely (to the other horses) since his aggression toward other horses is so extreme. I definitely think he should be gelded for a start! Though, I agree, this behavior is now learned behavior and not going to necessarily disappear after being gelded. This is a tough one indeed!

However, I'm going to rope in a couple of natural horsemanship colleagues here to see if they have any further suggestions, because both these guys have far more experience with stallions than I. I'm going to enlist the help here of good friend, natural horsemanship trainer Ed Dabney (www.eddabney.com) and our resident breeding/foaling expert, Bob Claymier, who is featured in our Whispering Way™ Foundation Training Series: Complete Guide to Horse Breeding, Foaling and Foal Training, Featuring Bob Claymier DVD set.

Here's Bob Claymier's response:

Sylvia asked me to weigh in here with my thoughts on your stallion situation. As a natural horsemanship breeder, this is a hot button topic of mine and one that I often get on a soap box about, so pardon me in advance. Sylvia was kind enough to mention my breeding DVD and I start off the series at the very beginning by attempting to dissuade those who should never be involved in this activity at all because so many unfortunate horses are produced as a result. In my own breeding program, I am a stickler for attempting to re-create a natural herd environment for all of my offspring and particularly the colts. This is admittedly a difficult situation to achieve, but I let my boys run with a herd for as long as possible (usually 1 ½ to 2 years of age depending on the hormonal development of the colt and time of year) and then put them with pregnant mares for further socialization. There does have to be separation at some point, but by then herd instincts have been instilled and as Sylvia so correctly points out, that is a limited window of opportunity. As so often is the case, it sounds as if your boy was not afforded this early-on training and you are left to deal with a potentially very difficult situation and one that may not be easily correctable if at all. Even if he were kept as a breeding stallion, the behavior you describe is not at all acceptable, as he would be dangerously out of control during that process as well.   

Now to your specific situation. You did not mention the breed of the horse and whether he had actually been in a breeding program or simply an isolated show horse. The only good news is that you report he is well mannered around people, is only 5-years-old and has shown SOME improvement when stalled next to your gelding. I ask about breed because I have seen Arabians – as an example – that are more easily retrained in similar situations. I have also seen some remarkable changes in behavior once a stallion is gelded, but it is usually limited to those that have virtually never bred and are a young age to begin with.

As Sylvia suggests, I would immediately geld this guy (it is the correct time of year as well/Fall) and then begin to see what – if any – effect this has on his behavior some 6-8 weeks (or longer) out – it will take that long for the testosterone to work out of his system. Like both you and Sylvia, I fear that he now has some learned antisocial behaviors that may prevent him from ever being a truly normal horse, but only time will tell that. Once gelded, you could begin to introduce him to other horses in a very controlled environment to see how he reacts. By that I mean things like stalling him next to other horses; putting him next to other horses across a fence while on a (long) controlled lead line; separating him and other horses by a tall strong fence; etc., all to see what his reaction is. There is also a hormonal drug given to mares to control their cycles that can be given to proud cut geldings and the like to affect their behavior which might be beneficial during transitional training that you will be doing with him and your vet can provide the product. His behavior in this environment will give you some clues of how next to proceed.

If he is still virtually out of control around other horses, then he likely will have to be isolated for the rest of his life and you will have to make a decision on whether that is acceptable in your situation. On the other hand, if there is improvement in his behavior, then you should be able to develop a gradual introduction program into a herd environment. If he shows some degree of control, he could perhaps be turned out in a field where he could graze across the fence from other horses (be mindful that he might attempt to jump the fence especially if mares were involved during their heat cycles).

If he were able to be ridden out safely with other horses while under control by an extremely experienced rider then this would be another step in the right direction. If all of this was positive, I would likely select a herd leader mare – preferably draft in size – and put them in a controlled environment like a round pen. I would put a rope halter on the now-gelding with a LONG lead line – protect yourself with gloves and a helmet – and see how both react to each other. There will come a time in this experiment where you have to be willing to remove the human element and let the horses sort it out for themselves. This obviously means there will still be risk involved regardless of the re-introduction techniques and training you have provided. You will have to determine at this point whether you believe significant progress has been made and whether all involved are willing to take that necessary risk.

This may be a 6 month to a year exercise (or longer) but the fact that you are willing to take on this stallion project is a testament that good people still exist in the horse world. You likely know the fate of this horse if you don’t try to turn him around and ultimately failing in this effort after giving it a good college try would be nothing to be ashamed about. I applaud your efforts, but do not envy the trials and tribulations that you will obviously be facing.

Keep us informed as to your progress and also let us know if we can be of any other assistance. Good luck - Bob Claymier
 

Here's Ed Dabney's response:

I am in complete agreement with Bob's excellent and very detailed reply and really could not add anything to what he has already suggested. I especially like Bob's description of the gradual socialization training using a controlled environment, good fences and a long lead line until you determine what the reaction will be. Before you start this socialization training, you should have already taught him to respect your leadership and have in place a systematic ground work program of movements and exercises to do with him so you can always gain his attention and control his movements on a lead line.

Too bad your horse missed out on that all important yearling socialization. Nothing like a bunch of old mares to teach a young stud colt some manners. I admire your dedication to your horse and your determination to help him.

Stay in the moment and enjoy the journey! -Ed Dabney

Complete Guide To Horse Breeding, Foaling and Foal Training Featuring Bob Claymier Includes THREE DVDs with a total of over four hours of video instruction and live demonstration covering every aspect of a successful breeding program!     3 Set!   The Complete Guide To Horse Breeding, Foaling and Foal Training 3-DVD set includes a total of over four hours of video instruction featuring Natural Horsemanship trainer and expert horse breeder, Bob Claymier. Over one and a half years in the making, the Whispering Way™ Foundation Training Series Complete Guide To Horse Breeding, Foaling and Foal Training is the first video series to show you the entire horse breeding and early foal care process. Expert horse breeder Bob Claymier guides you through every step in a successful horse breeding program -- from selection of the mare and stallion, to mare care and exams, to actual live cover and artificial insemination breeding procedures, to foal birth and imprinting, and finally on to early foal handling and training. Each step is documented with live video examples and is accompanied by expert commentary from Bob and the highly experienced veterinarians, farriers and others that help make his breeding program so successful. Three DVD Set The Complete Guide To Horse Breeding, Foaling and Foal Training is presented over three included DVDs:     Volume 1: Mare and Stallion Selection, Collection, Exams and Breeding (1 hr, 21 min) Mare and Stallion Selection, Ultrasound Procedures, Stallion Collection and Live Cover Breeding, Artificial Insemination and Pregnancy Check     Volume 2: Late Stage Pregnancy, Foal Birth and Imprinting (1 hr, 22 min) Late Stage Pregnancy, Foaling Kit, Foal Birth, Foal Imprinting     Volume 3: Foal Care and Early Training (1 hr, 26 min) Veterinarian Visits After Foal Birth, Farrier’s First Visits With Foal, Halter Training the Foal, Weaning the Foal About Bob Claymier Bob Claymier is the owner and operator of Desert Rose Ranch Arabians (www.desert-rose-arabians.com), a breeding, training and field boarding horse facility located near the foothills of the Blue Ridge Mountains in the heart of Virginia horse country. Bob provides on-site daily care of the horse facility and trains and shows their younger horses. He has studied and practices all training methods that can be described as Natural Horsemanship, where a calm bonding and loving relationship is developed between humans and horses. His breeding, foaling and foal care program ensures that all foals born at his facility receive the finest handling and training, and he participates in all births and imprints his foals immediately upon birth. Bob’s goal is to produce safe, loving, people-oriented horses that are stamped with his gentle training methods. NOTE: In addition to mare care and foal care/early training, this DVD set contains explicit live video of many important aspects of the overall horse breeding process, including: mare pre/post pregnancy ultrasound exams, “live cover” breeding with mare and stallion, stallion semen collection methods, artificial insemination, and actual foal birth.   Total Running Time (3 DVDs): 4 Hours 9 Minutes   Complete Guide to Horse Breeding, Foaling and Foal Training, Featuring Bob Claymier Video Set Testimonial Quotes Click Here:     To order the Complete Guide To Horse Breeding, Foaling and Foal Training, Click Here: